Talk:Mughal Empire

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"uplands of the Deccan Plateau"

The lead says that the empire stretched south to the "uplands of the Deccan Plateau", yet this is contradictory to the map, which puts the southern boundary much further south than the limits of the Deccan, at the same latitude as Nagapattinam. The source used for the claim [1] is specifically talking about the territory held under Akbar rather than the "peak" (i.e. ~1700, Aurangzeb) described in the lead. What should the lead say the southern boundary was? Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 02:16, 15 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@RegentsPark @PadFoot2008 thoughts? I have not been able to find any sources describing the boundaries of the empire under Aurangzeb. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 08:08, 20 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Flemmish Nietzsche, perhaps we can rephrase it to to say:

lower reaches of the Deccan peninsula in South India.

instead of:

uplands of the Deccan plateau in South India.

PadFoot (talk) 11:05, 20 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Flag

Flags of the Mughal Empire ,it shows multiple historical paintings from Mughal era with flags being represented,aren't these painting enough source for flags? JingJongPascal (talk) 17:25, 1 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Unfortunately not. Paintings capture events at a moment in time and we have no idea what the significance of a particular flag in a painting was or even if it was something imagined by the painter rather than actually used as a representative flag. What we need is a reliable source from a historian that states, unequivocally, that a particular flag was the representative flag of a ruler, state, or dynasty. RegentsPark (comment) 00:42, 2 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You can search the archives of this talk page to see why a flag is not displayed. Remsense ‥ 论 00:41, 2 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Multiple Maps

I have added another map with switcher

The peak extent will still be the default one tho JingJongPascal (talk) 18:21, 1 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I know you didn't realize since you're on mobile, but your edit totally broke the article display on desktop. I also do not think two maps are necessary. Consider asking first next time. Remsense ‥ 论 00:37, 2 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I added multiple Maps as Ottoman Empire

Also had multiple depicting their change in territories, I didn't realise the article broke on desktop JingJongPascal (talk) 07:16, 2 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 24 December 2024

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Mughal empire was not empire from the beginning of babur, rather it became after akbar reign, so like u ppl created two pages for both chola empire and dynasty, pls do the same here or remove the dynasty page of cholas. This is serious matter of fact which needs to be looked into Suimadniggszh (talk) 05:42, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

the case is same like mughals, even cholas became empire only after rajaraja Suimadniggszh (talk) 05:43, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. The AP (talk) 13:52, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Mughal rulers

Mughal rules is (AD1557-1560) 106.222.164.36 (talk) 13:35, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The Official Language

For user:Malik-Al-Hind

The second official language of East India Company rule in India from 1773 to 1837 was Persian. Only in 1837 was the official language changed to Urdu, which was then called "Hindustani."^[1]^[2]^[3]^[4]^[5] It is unlikely that Urdu was the official language of the Mughals. The British would not have waited 64 years. As for the Wikipedia page Hindustani, it is a POV-page, which perpetrates a view held mainly in post-colonial India, that by muddying the waters between Urdu and Modern Standard Hindi, and calling it Hindustani, they can keep alive the fiction that Urdu has not suffered a decline in the land of its birth. Fowler&fowler «Talk» 15:42, 18 February 2025 (UTC) Fowler&fowler «Talk» 15:42, 18 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

At this point you ignored all the WP:RS backed up sources i quoted. Besides for that, I agree Persian was the official language too but Urdu too.

"During the Mogul rule, Persian replaced the position of Sanskrit as the offi- cial language in administration especially in conducting the court proceedings, etc. Persian continued as the official language till the time of Emperor Shajahan in the seventeen century, when Hindustani (Urdu) took the position of the official language in the Mughal courts,yet Sanskrit continued to be used as the intellectual language in teaching classical sciences, philosophy, religion, etc. That synergy of Persian, Urdu (Hindustani) and Sanskrit had continued as the administrative and intellec- tual languages during the Mughal period"[2]

As per this source, Persian remained the language used in administrative and other official purposes but Urdu too had become an official language and even started having more influence than Persian in some instances. So don't remove it. If you have problems with Hindustani then we will replace it with Urdu. Malik-Al-Hind (talk) 03:33, 19 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

^ Garcia, Humberto (2020), England Re-Oriented: How Central and South Asian Travelers Imagined the West, 1750–1857, Cambridge University Press, p. 128, ISBN 978-1-108-49564-6, "Hindoostanee" was instrumental for Company rule in that Gilchrist's grammar books, dictionaries, and translations helped to standardize Urdu as an official language for lower level judicial courts and revenue administration in 1837, replacing Persian.
^ Schiffman, Harold (2011), Language Policy and Language Conflict in Afghanistan and Its Neighbors: The Changing Politics of Language Choice, BRILL, p. 11, ISBN 978-90-04-20145-3, In 1837 Urdu was formally adopted by the British, in place of Persian, as the language of interaction between the Government (which from then on conducted its affairs in English) and the local population.
^ Everaert, Christine (2009), Tracing the Boundaries between Hindi and Urdu: Lost and Added in Translation between 20th Century Short Stories, BRILL, pp. 253–, ISBN 978-90-04-18223-3, It was only in 1837 that Persian lost its position as official language of India to Urdu and to English in the higher levels of administration.
^ Bayly, Christopher Alan (1999), Empire and Information: Intelligence Gathering and Social Communication in India, 1780–1870, Cambridge University Press, p. 286, ISBN 978-0-521-66360-1, Paradoxically, many British also clung to Persian. Indeed, the so-called Urdu that replaced Persian as the court language after 1837 was recognisably Persian as far as its nouns were concerned. The courtly heritage of Persian was also to exercise a constraint on the British cultivation of Hindustani/Urdu.
^ Lelyveld, David (1993). "Colonial Knowledge and the Fate of Hindustani". Comparative Studies in Society and History. 35 (4). Cambridge University Press: 665–682, 674. The earlier grammars and dictionaries made it possible for the British government to replace Persian with vernacular languages at the lower levels of judicial and revenue administration in 1837, that is, to standardize and index terminology for official use and provide for its translation to the language of the ultimate ruling authority, English. For such purposes Hindustani was equated with Urdu, as opposed to any geographically defined dialect of Hindi and was given official status through large parts of north India. Written in the Persian script with a largely Persian and, via Persian, an Arabic vocabulary, Urdu stood at the shortest distance from the previous situation and was easily attainable by the same personnel.

[Garcia2020-1] Garcia, Humberto (2020), England Re-Oriented: How Central and South Asian Travelers Imagined the West, 1750–1857, Cambridge University Press, p. 128, ISBN 978-1-108-49564-6, "Hindoostanee" was instrumental for Company rule in that Gilchrist's grammar books, dictionaries, and translations helped to standardize Urdu as an official language for lower level judicial courts and revenue administration in 1837, replacing Persian.

[Schiffman2011-2] Schiffman, Harold (2011), Language Policy and Language Conflict in Afghanistan and Its Neighbors: The Changing Politics of Language Choice, BRILL, p. 11, ISBN 978-90-04-20145-3, In 1837 Urdu was formally adopted by the British, in place of Persian, as the language of interaction between the Government (which from then on conducted its affairs in English) and the local population.

[everaert-3] Everaert, Christine (2009), Tracing the Boundaries between Hindi and Urdu: Lost and Added in Translation between 20th Century Short Stories, BRILL, pp. 253–, ISBN 978-90-04-18223-3, It was only in 1837 that Persian lost its position as official language of India to Urdu and to English in the higher levels of administration.

[BaylyBayly1999-4] Bayly, Christopher Alan (1999), Empire and Information: Intelligence Gathering and Social Communication in India, 1780–1870, Cambridge University Press, p. 286, ISBN 978-0-521-66360-1, Paradoxically, many British also clung to Persian. Indeed, the so-called Urdu that replaced Persian as the court language after 1837 was recognisably Persian as far as its nouns were concerned. The courtly heritage of Persian was also to exercise a constraint on the British cultivation of Hindustani/Urdu.

[lelyveld-hindustani-5] Lelyveld, David (1993). "Colonial Knowledge and the Fate of Hindustani". Comparative Studies in Society and History. 35 (4). Cambridge University Press: 665–682, 674. The earlier grammars and dictionaries made it possible for the British government to replace Persian with vernacular languages at the lower levels of judicial and revenue administration in 1837, that is, to standardize and index terminology for official use and provide for its translation to the language of the ultimate ruling authority, English. For such purposes Hindustani was equated with Urdu, as opposed to any geographically defined dialect of Hindi and was given official status through large parts of north India. Written in the Persian script with a largely Persian and, via Persian, an Arabic vocabulary, Urdu stood at the shortest distance from the previous situation and was easily attainable by the same personnel.

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